Jump to content

  •  
- - - - -

Looking Ahead: Bismack Biyombo


What is a fair contract for Biz this offseason? Is he replacable for a smaller amount? If so by who?

FWIW here is his stats page:

http://espn.go.com/n...bismack-biyombo

In considering this we shouldn't forget his age, his time playing organized ball and in spite of this being 3rd in the league among qualified players in blocks per minute & block percentage. The two ahead of him are Anthony Davis and Serge Ibaka. Granted the minutes aren't equal but it's still nothing to sneeze at.


  • 87 Comments

    Photo
    Felton for Prez
    Apr 29 2014 07:43 PM

    I didn't see this posted anywhere elsewhere but may have missed it.  I love me some Biz, I do, but this is some pretty scary stuff. 

     

    http://regressing.de...s-to-1568943439

    I didn't see this posted anywhere elsewhere but may have missed it.  I love me some Biz, I do, but this is some pretty scary stuff. 

     

    http://regressing.de...s-to-1568943439

     

    For people that are holding out hope for Biz, the link above will make you.... sad  :cry:

     

     

    Bismack receives the ball once every 3.9 minutes that he is on the court. Even on the surface, this is remarkable. Four minutes is a long time! Already this year, 13 people have run an entire mile in (basically) less time than it takes, on average, for a teammate to pass Bismack the ball. And when you consider that Biyombo's minutes as a substitute often coincide with TV timeouts, he often goes 10 or 15 actual minutes without a teammate giving him the ball on purpose.

    How is this possible? Bismack has three key deficiencies on offense: He cannot catch, or shoot, or dribble. These are serious problems, of course, but they are further compounded by the fact that, very often, he does not know where to stand, in the Andrea-Bargnani-on-defense, walking-around-in-circles-and-getting-yelled-at-by-teammates manner, and commits moving screen violations with enough frequency to rank with Jeremy Lin on turnover percentage. 

    I personally find it really, really funny.

    Photo
    Mackey_Rose
    Apr 30 2014 09:04 AM

    According to ShamSports he is still locked up for next year at $3.9 million, and then has a $5.2 QO for the next year.  Is this correct?

     

    If it is, I think you have to eat this last year of his deal, and see what happens.  Unless he makes some kind of miraculous improvement however,  (and I wouldn't hold my breath) there is just no way you can give him his QO at that number.  He isn't worth half of that.

     

    I have only watched him for about a year and half, so I haven't watched him as long as you all have, and maybe he already has made a huge leap from where he was, but my goodness.

    According to ShamSports he is still locked up for next year at $3.9 million, and then has a $5.2 QO for the next year.  Is this correct?

     

    If it is, I think you have to eat this last year of his deal, and see what happens.  Unless he makes some kind of miraculous improvement however,  (and I wouldn't hold my breath) there is just no way you can give him his QO at that number.  He isn't worth half of that.

     

    I have only watched him for about a year and half, so I haven't watched him as long as you all have, and maybe he already has made a huge leap from where he was, but my goodness.

     

    I actually wouldn't have too hard of a time giving him the QO because it gives you a mid-sized expiring contract to use building trades. Obviously it depends on what Charlotte's cap situation is with everyone else, but a one-year deal at $5 million isn't an albatross. That being said, if Charlotte's sure they're committed to "Al Jefferson, cornerstone center", and I think they are, it's probably time to start throwing Biz in fake trades. He's simply never going to get big-time minutes in that scenario and Cody can take over the backup duties there.

    I see  Biz this year V/S last year  . He may be the most inproved player on the team .   He sets much better picks [ even better than AL now]    With Ewing I have saw moves he couldn't make last season not many but some.. H.  He rebounds better %  with playing time into account . He's the best rim pootecter  we have .  He's more physical this year . He's inproving  I just don't know if it's fast enough for Clifford.

    Cody proved in the playoffs he's got to add ton's more strength  to play the five . I would give Biz one more year and go from their . Unless a value trade comes along

    That article, while factual and an accurate account of his offensive contributions, is meaningless.  

     

     

    He's been playing organized basketball for 6 years, is now on his 3rd coaching staff in the NBA alone.  He is a project player, on a team that suddenly wanted to make the playoffs.   I don't think Clifford doesn't like him, I just don't think playing time and offensive game planning for Biz were high on his priority list this season.   We had a lot to worry about to get where we wanted to be this season, and Biz becoming an offensive juggernaut wasn't high on the list.  

     

     

    So yeah, he isn't going to get a lot of balls thrown his way on this team in this situation.               Qualifying offer is high, but i'd pay it for a rim protector with still massive potential that stays healthy and is well liked by fans and teammates. 

    Photo
    Mackey_Rose
    Apr 30 2014 10:24 AM

    That article, while factual and an accurate account of his offensive contributions, is meaningless.  

     

     

    He's been playing organized basketball for 6 years, is now on his 3rd coaching staff in the NBA alone.  He is a project player, on a team that suddenly wanted to make the playoffs.   I don't think Clifford doesn't like him, I just don't think playing time and offensive game planning for Biz were high on his priority list this season.   We had a lot to worry about to get where we wanted to be this season, and Biz becoming an offensive juggernaut wasn't high on the list.  

     

     

    So yeah, he isn't going to get a lot of balls thrown his way on this team in this situation.               Qualifying offer is high, but i'd pay it for a rim protector with still massive potential that stays healthy and is well liked by fans and teammates. 

     

    That QO number would be easier to stomach if he was just close to average offensively.  He doesn't need to be a juggernaut.  He just needs to not be the liability that he was this season.  Being a good rim protector is great, but you can't afford to play 4 on 5 all the time on the other end.  Roy Hibbert here in these playoffs is the perfect example.  The Pacers can't afford to put him on the floor.  At all.  He absolutely kills them.

     

    They have all of next year to evaluate his progress, but as an outsider without any kind of attachment to him based on where he was drafted, I don't see it.

    Photo
    QC Thundercats
    Apr 30 2014 10:56 AM
    I think with Biz being so young to the game, and not having the best coordination on the block, I don't think he's gonna ever have an effective regular post up game, other than a couple opportunities here or there.

    I have seen him make a couple nice "Big Al" moves his year, but he'll never acquire that natural feel or understanding without years of experience. Al is obviously a low block savant, and guys even with decades of experience don't have the feel, awareness, or touch of Al. But then, Biz is years of experience behind even those guys.

    What I would love to see biz focus on is actually to develop a consistent 12-15 foot jumper. He has decent form, and this would actually enable him to play with Al, since if they try to double, he could punish other teams with mid range jumpers all day. The screen and roll game would open up too, as he could step out for the jumper while defenses collapse onto Kemba. Then this could open up a pump fake and drive game for him as well.

    Udonis Haslem was never a post up guy, but made a very good career of mid range shots and good defense. If I recall correctly, Charles Oakley was never a true post up guy either, but had an awesome midrange, great defense, and would kick your ass if you owed him money.

    So, to go along with Biz's excellent defensive instincts and talent, a good mid range jumper could go a lot farther to make him realize his potential much better than trying to make him a back to the basket player.
    I personally think the biggest loser in the Sessions/Adrien trade was Biz. I am not blaming Ridnour particularly but he was not used to playing with a guy that was so limited in where he can catch the ball. He took steps backward almost immediately after that trade from my memory and never made it fully back. And I think it affected his playing time oddly enough to not be competing for the spot with Adrian.

    To me, the Wednesday night snow game showed a peek of what Biz can be. ICYMI, he was 5-5 for 10 pts, 4 boards (2 O/2 D), 1 monumental block in NINE mins. The guy is just hustle incarnate. Might hustle the wrong way at times but when he's pointed in the right direction he's a good addition of the bench. I am all for keeping him and watching him continue to evolve.

    Biz has to stay around if for no other reason so that we can lose our minds when he treats us to the #BiyomboEuroStep

     

    http://www.nba.com/v...-mem-play2.nba/

    I personally think the biggest loser in the Sessions/Adrien trade was Biz. I am not blaming Ridnour particularly but he was not used to playing with a guy that was so limited in where he can catch the ball. He took steps backward almost immediately after that trade from my memory and never made it fully back. And I think it affected his playing time oddly enough to not be competing for the spot with Adrian.

     

    I feel like it was more Clifford shortening the rotation both because of Jefferson's excellent play and the playoffs rapidly approaching. As long as he's behind Jefferson he'll get minutes early in the season, but it's just never going to be an equitable distribution when the games start mattering. 

    Photo
    BrotherDave
    Apr 30 2014 10:47 PM

    Biz is statistically one of the best rim protectors on a team that no longer has another one since trading Adrien. It would be dumb not to value him and make sure we retain him at his young age. Most big men don't show promise until their mid 20s but Biz is already showing that he can be elite at something and that's altering shots at the rim.

    This can't be stated enough.  His opponent's FG % at the rim is elite.  This is one of those advanced stats that is actually consequential.  Rim protection is vital for success in the NBA, even more so with handchecking disallowed.  Biz is worth $5M per easily.  He's statistically one of the best pick setters in the league, his rebounding has improved monumentally and offensively he's finally developing a decent feel for the game.  If you give him the same volume of shots as Zeller had, I would be surprised if Biz showed a worse % from mid range b/c his form is much better.  I wouldn't be surprised at all if a team offered him 7-8M per.

    Photo
    Mackey_Rose
    May 01 2014 07:41 AM

    This can't be stated enough.  His opponent's FG % at the rim is elite.  This is one of those advanced stats that is actually consequential.  Rim protection is vital for success in the NBA, even more so with handchecking disallowed.  Biz is worth $5M per easily.  He's statistically one of the best pick setters in the league, his rebounding has improved monumentally and offensively he's finally developing a decent feel for the game.  If you give him the same volume of shots as Zeller had, I would be surprised if Biz showed a worse % from mid range b/c his form is much better.  I wouldn't be surprised at all if a team offered him 7-8M per.

    Insane.  Nobody is paying him Asik money.

    Ahh, but what is Asik money Mackey? 8.3mm or 15mm? :). Sorry, the Lisik contract monies are my favorite esoterics to contemplate lol.
    Photo
    Mackey_Rose
    May 01 2014 09:38 AM

    Ahh, but what is Asik money Mackey? 8.3mm or 15mm? :). Sorry, the Lisik contract monies are my favorite esoterics to contemplate lol.

    He signed a 3 year $25 million contract, so it works out to $8.3 per year.

    Ahh, but what is Asik money Mackey? 8.3mm or 15mm? :). Sorry, the Lisik contract monies are my favorite esoterics to contemplate lol.

    Mackey is correct the cap hit is 8,3m but a team still has to "pay" him $14,898,938 this season. Who wants to pay Asik that much for this season...not me.

    He signed a 3 year $25 million contract, so it works out to $8.3 per year.


    It only works out that way if you have him for three years.

    It only works out that way if you have him for three years.

     

    Yes, but that's what "Asik money" is - the average yearly value of his contract. The balloon payment doesn't really matter in this particular way the contract is being discussed. 

    Yes, but that's what "Asik money" is - the average yearly value of his contract. The balloon payment doesn't really matter in this particular way the contract is being discussed.


    Disagree. Asik at 8mm/8mm is more of an asset to any team than Asik at 8mm/15mm. You simply can not compare him apples to apples with any other player at 8mm per year.
    Photo
    BrotherDave
    May 01 2014 07:50 PM

    Insane.  Nobody is paying him Asik money.

    Biz statistically had a better year than Asik.  

    Biz statistically had a better year than Asik.  

     

    http://espn.go.com/n.../3414/omer-asik

     

    http://espn.go.com/n...bismack-biyombo

     

    Really?

    Photo
    Mackey_Rose
    May 02 2014 08:46 AM

    Disagree. Asik at 8mm/8mm is more of an asset to any team than Asik at 8mm/15mm. You simply can not compare him apples to apples with any other player at 8mm per year.

     

    Regardless, nobody is paying Biyombo an average of $7-8 million per year on any long term deal.  That would be incredibly asinine considering his current production.

     

    But back to the Asik thing, you have the terms of his contract wrong.  While that last year of his deal is onerous, it was necessary for them to get him in uniform.  As a restricted free agent, Chicago would have likely matched, and kept him, had that poison pill not been included.  No matter how it breaks down, he's still making about $8.3 million per year on average.  I doubt I need to break down what average means, but it basically means he doesn't have to make exactly $8.3 million, every year of his contract, to still AVERAGE that amount of annual salary.  The 3 year $25 million deal worked out as:

     

    2012-2013 = $5,000,000

    2013-2014 = $5,225,000

    2014-2015 = $14,898,938

     

     

    Biz statistically had a better year than Asik.  

     

    http://www.basketbal...yombi01&y2=2014

     

    Here is a direct comparison of the two players this year.  I can only assume by saying that Biyombo was better than Asik statistically means you are really putting all of your stat eggs into that rim protection basket that was posted earlier in this thread.  Because in reality, while Biyombo may have defended the rim at an elite level, Asik was far, far better than him, as a basketball player.

     

    In 104 fewer minutes (due to injury, Asik only played in 48 games), Asik scored more points, grabbed more rebounds, had more assists, and more steals.  Basically he outplayed him in every facet of the game, except shot blocking which is the absolute only thing that Biyombo offers at this point in his career.

    Asik, in 2014 is 8.3mm against your cap and he's 15mm out of your owner's pocket. Any other conversation of what he "was" last year or the average of three matters nothing to someone that would pick up his contract this off-season. They get no benefit of the average of three years if he's traded, they simply get a guy that is 8.3mm against their cap and 15mm out of their pocket. The most (the last I checked as I understood it) that Houston could offset a trade with cash is $3mm so regardless, you are paying Asik more out of pocket than any other 8.3mm player on the market (other than Lin).




    Latest Forum Topics