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people told me they want tees with my hornet fan art. there ya go!

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#1 supjackjack Posted 15 July 2015 - 09:30 AM

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It's just $12, but we need some people to reserve it for production!

This limited edition will be available for 4 more days. http://teespring.com...-by-supjackjack

 

It is configured with Top quality American Apparel Crew shirt by teespring.com

 

Note: majority of money goes to teespring.com who takes care of entire production, online ordering, customer service, and shipping. I m in it Just so I can have something cool to wear as well as fulfilling people's request.

 

if we dont reach the reserveation goal in 7 days, money would NOT be charged to those who have already made the reservation. I'd have an idea how many people actually want the shirt, and I'll reduce the production quantity on next campaign, so we all can get the shirt (Unit price for each tee will go up depending on how much less we are doing)

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#2 Adam42R Posted 15 July 2015 - 09:34 AM

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So why exactly should we, the fans of the Hornets, rip off our own team by buying unlicensed merchandise?
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#3 supjackjack Posted 15 July 2015 - 09:58 AM

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So why exactly should we, the fans of the Hornets, rip off our own team by buying unlicensed merchandise?

I originally designed it just for fun. Hornets sub reddit is using it for side bar and people started requesting the t shirt with this graphic. That is why I made it available at just $12 using teespring.com not intending to make any money.

I provide the image, teespring takes care the rest.

I would agree it is rip off if I just copy and paste Hornets image. But please don't make it sound like I did.
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#4 Mustachio Posted 15 July 2015 - 10:05 AM

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I don't really think it's ripping anyone off.  it's his own design and I think it's pretty sweet.  Most of the fan bases have these types of close but not exactly fan clubs and t-shirt designers.  I'm good with it.

 

Throwing ads on a forum you just joined... probably not so cool.  

 

 

 

I rarely go to r/hornets but I did after the Lin signing.  It was pretty apocalyptic over there.  Wall to wall Lin.  


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#5 buckets Posted 15 July 2015 - 10:20 AM

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So why exactly should we, the fans of the Hornets, rip off our own team by buying unlicensed merchandise?

 

 

With a nice electronic trail it's like "Hey the criminals are here and this is the list"


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#6 InProblematique Posted 15 July 2015 - 10:57 AM

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So why exactly should we, the fans of the Hornets, rip off our own team by buying unlicensed merchandise?

If the Hornets had a shirt this sweet for 12 bucks, I'd buy it. They don't on either account. So I have no problem with this, especially since he's only doing one limited run.

 

Also, I saw the original design on the Hornets subreddit and a lot of people were asking if he would put it on a t-shirt.


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#7 Mrfixit Posted 15 July 2015 - 11:29 AM

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This dude made a really cool logo and slapped it on a shirt.  He is not trying to make money or screw over the Hornets merchandizing people.  He responded to requests to put it on a shirt.  I see no problem with him using his own creativity to give hornets fans a unique shirt that cannot be found anywhere else.  


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#8 buckets Posted 15 July 2015 - 11:38 AM

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This dude made a really cool logo and slapped it on a shirt.  He is not trying to make money or screw over the Hornets merchandizing people.  He responded to requests to put it on a shirt.  I see no problem with him using his own creativity to give hornets fans a unique shirt that cannot be found anywhere else.  

 

 

Ummmm...his account was opened 8 hours before soliciting your business. Business that is not his to legally sell.


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#9 buckets Posted 15 July 2015 - 11:40 AM

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Mods this thread should be taken down


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#10 Mustachio Posted 15 July 2015 - 11:44 AM

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Ummmm...his account was opened 8 hours before soliciting your business. Business that is not his to legally sell.

 

 

What exactly is illegal about this?


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#11 supjackjack Posted 15 July 2015 - 11:46 AM

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I don't really think it's ripping anyone off.  it's his own design and I think it's pretty sweet.  Most of the fan bases have these types of close but not exactly fan clubs and t-shirt designers.  I'm good with it.

 

Throwing ads on a forum you just joined... probably not so cool.  

 

 

 

I rarely go to r/hornets but I did after the Lin signing.  It was pretty apocalyptic over there.  Wall to wall Lin.  

 

I do apologize it does seems like an ad. 

 

Just hope we can all get our t-shirt that is all. The campaign requires quite a few to produce at such low price.

I also ordered 4 for myself. (at same price) There are other fans who also reserved some.


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#12 Mrfixit Posted 15 July 2015 - 11:47 AM

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With a nice electronic trail it's like "Hey the criminals are here and this is the list"

 

Not sure what is criminal about this.  There does not seem to be any type of trademark infringement either.  There is no mention of "Charlotte" or "Hornets." It is not one of the official Hornets logos. The only potential issue is the similar color scheme and a bee.   Actually, they do not have the colors as part of the trademark and the bee used in supjack's design does not have a basketball making up part of its body.  Here is a link to the Hornets registered trademark.  http://tmsearch.uspt...801:x8ayae.2.1

 

 

Ummmm...his account was opened 8 hours before soliciting your business. Business that is not his to legally sell.

 

Like he said, he posted this on reddit 4 days ago and is trying to drum up enough people to buy it so the people who want the shirt can get it.  Not sure why you are so concerned about this. 

 

edit: spelling


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#13 supjackjack Posted 15 July 2015 - 11:50 AM

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This dude made a really cool logo and slapped it on a shirt.  He is not trying to make money or screw over the Hornets merchandizing people.  He responded to requests to put it on a shirt.  I see no problem with him using his own creativity to give hornets fans a unique shirt that cannot be found anywhere else.  

 

 

 

Mods this thread should be taken down

 

if fans do demand this to be taken down. I can understand and I respect people's decision.


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#14 buckets Posted 15 July 2015 - 11:54 AM

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It's easily infringement. It doesn't  have to be identical just "substantially similar." The mere fact the individual is marketing on a Hornets board and everyone recognizes the similarity is enough.

 

Besides - is this the precedent people want? Non-member spammers who create threads to sell stuff?


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#15 supjackjack Posted 15 July 2015 - 11:57 AM

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Ummmm...his account was opened 8 hours before soliciting your business. Business that is not his to legally sell.

 

i opened the account to call out the crazy "hard core" Lin fan.

 

did not intend to post anything else here at first. I figured some fans here might want the shirt like reddit users.

And it's will help reaching the goal so rest of us can all get the shirt at just $12.


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#16 supjackjack Posted 15 July 2015 - 12:08 PM

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It's easily infringement. It doesn't have to be identical just "substantially similar." The mere fact the individual is marketing on a Hornets board and everyone recognizes the similarity is enough.

Besides - is this the precedent people want? Non-member spammers who create threads to sell stuff?

How am I a spammer if I am only answering people's request?

The worst thing can happen is the campaign fails, and no one gets their t shirt. No one gets charged. I spend more money myself to get it printed elsewhere not being able to share my creation with fans who like my design.
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#17 QC Thundercats Posted 15 July 2015 - 12:15 PM

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Nice looking shirt, almost looks like an Avengers logo.... however, in regards to trademarks....

 

It isn't criminal in the sense that you're not going to jail for it, but the standard for trademark infringement is the likelihood of confusion.  That is, would an average person you meet on the street think that this shirt is from the Charlotte Hornets.  There are several things to consider in a likelihood of confusion analysis, such as similarity in name, spelling, sound, or design, if it is the same type of goods or is marketed to similar customers.  And it is strikingly similar to the Hornets side logo, which has been registered for selling clothing.

xuY3fvV.png

 

Because its in black and white, using the same or a very similar looking Hornet or bee would be protected under any color.  Another big part of trademarks is something called secondary meaning, where even if its not trademarked, a company would still give protection because the general population has come to understand that something is associated with a particular brand.  The NBA and Charlotte Hornets brand is an incredibly strong brand with global recognition, and is worth maybe billions by now.

 

So unfortunately, a side swooping hornet in purple in teal, being sold in a class of goods that has already been trademarked by the team - there is a pretty good chance that if the team found out and pursued an infringement case, they'd win.  Which would probably entail taking all your profits, having you destroy all merchandise with the logo, and probably paying their court costs and attorney fees.  They'd probably send a cease and desist letter to get you to stop first before filing a lawsuit, but I don't know if I'd necessarily publicize these shirts for sale if there's a good chance they may find out.

 

Just an FYI...

 

 

 

Edit: Another interesting thing, it seems the team has just applied to register Frank the Tank.


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#18 supjackjack Posted 15 July 2015 - 12:27 PM

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Nice looking shirt, almost looks like an Avengers logo.... however, in regards to trademarks....

It isn't criminal in the sense that you're not going to jail for it, but the standard for trademark infringement is the likelihood of confusion. That is, would an average person you meet on the street think that this shirt is from the Charlotte Hornets. There are several things to consider in a likelihood of confusion analysis, such as similarity in name, spelling, sound, or design, if it is the same type of goods or is marketed to similar customers. And it is strikingly similar to the Hornets side logo, which has been registered for selling clothing.
xuY3fvV.png

Because its in black and white, using the same or a very similar looking Hornet or bee would be protected under any color. Another big part of trademarks is something called secondary meaning, where even if its not trademarked, a company would still give protection because the general population has come to understand that something is associated with a particular brand. The NBA and Charlotte Hornets brand is an incredibly strong brand with global recognition, and is worth maybe billions by now.

So unfortunately, a side swooping hornet in purple in teal, being sold in a class of goods that has already been trademarked by the team - there is a pretty good chance that if the team found out and pursued an infringement case, they'd win. Which would probably entail taking all your profits, having you destroy all merchandise with the logo, and probably paying their court costs and attorney fees. They'd probably send a cease and desist letter to get you to stop first before filing a lawsuit, but I don't know if I'd necessarily publicize these shirts for sale if there's a good chance they may find out.

Just an FYI...



Edit: Another interesting thing, it seems the team has just applied to register Frank the Tank.


I appreciate the information. I did tweet the design to @hornets numerous times without getting any response.


I will write a formal letter to Hornets Organization to make sure they are cool with it. If they are not okay with this, I'll ask teespring to suspend the campaign and not charge people.

Thanks again.


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#19 Mrfixit Posted 15 July 2015 - 12:30 PM

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Nice looking shirt, almost looks like an Avengers logo.... however, in regards to trademarks....

 

It isn't criminal in the sense that you're not going to jail for it, but the standard for trademark infringement is the likelihood of confusion.  That is, would an average person you meet on the street think that this shirt is from the Charlotte Hornets.  There are several things to consider in a likelihood of confusion analysis, such as similarity in name, spelling, sound, or design, if it is the same type of goods or is marketed to similar customers.  And it is strikingly similar to the Hornets side logo, which has been registered for selling clothing.

xuY3fvV.png

 

Because its in black and white, using the same or a very similar looking Hornet or bee would be protected under any color.  Another big part of trademarks is something called secondary meaning, where even if its not trademarked, a company would still give protection because the general population has come to understand that something is associated with a particular brand.  The NBA and Charlotte Hornets brand is an incredibly strong brand with global recognition, and is worth maybe billions by now.

 

So unfortunately, a side swooping hornet in purple in teal, being sold in a class of goods that has already been trademarked by the team - there is a pretty good chance that if the team found out and pursued an infringement case, they'd win.  Which would probably entail taking all your profits, having you destroy all merchandise with the logo, and probably paying their court costs and attorney fees.  They'd probably send a cease and desist letter to get you to stop first before filing a lawsuit, but I don't know if I'd necessarily publicize these shirts for sale if there's a good chance they may find out.

 

Just an FYI...

 

This is a good analysis and you have pretty much convinced me.  But, in my mind, a side swooping Hornet is kind of generic because it is just a bee.  What makes the Hornets logo unique is the fact that the bee's abdomen is a basketball in all the Hornets logos.  Surely, the basketball being part of the anatomy is what makes the bee distinctive.  If the basketball is not important, then wouldn't the hornets have the right to any teal, purple, and white bee facing sideways?

 

edit: grammar


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#20 buckets Posted 15 July 2015 - 12:37 PM

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I appreciate the information. I did tweet the design to @hornets numerous times without getting much response.


I will write a formal letter to Hornets Organization to make sure they are cool with it. If they are not okay with this, I'll ask teespring to suspend the campaign and not charge people.

Thanks again.

 

 

Classic - swiping intellectual property and then explicitly indicating you knew permission was required. Can't make this stuff up.


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