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Cliff - Should he stay or should he go now...

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#1 spaceshoes Posted 06 April 2018 - 07:30 PM

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Swarm and Sting reporting rumors that Cliff is possibly done at the end of the season. We've had the GM thread. Now. Let's hear your thoughts about whether or not we should keep him. If you think he should go, you have to throw a name out.

What do you guys think about Fizdale? Seems as though he had the Grizzlies in decent shape until things went south between him and Gasol. That being said I don't know tons about him. Could he be a good fit here?
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#2 Buzzau Posted 06 April 2018 - 08:12 PM

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I think he needs to go. We continuously underperform and he refuses to make any lineup changes and one of our most exciting rookie prospects ever rides the bench most of the year. Time to bring someone else in.
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#3 Mich_Mercer Posted 06 April 2018 - 08:20 PM

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I'd like to see him go and get someone younger who's interested in developing younger talent. Monks showing that he should have been playing all along. He's already average 20 a game with 30 mpg. I could see him being our top scorer next season. He's he help Kemba needed all year, but yet, we let him rot on the bench so he could "learn". It makes me wonder, if MKW didn't get hurt, would he even be playing now?
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#4 dnbman Posted 06 April 2018 - 08:28 PM

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I'd like to see him go and get someone younger who's interested in developing younger talent. Monks showing that he should have been playing all along. He's already average 20 a game with 30 mpg. I could see him being our top scorer next season. He's he help Kemba needed all year, but yet, we let him rot on the bench so he could "learn". It makes me wonder, if MKW didn't get hurt, would he even be playing now?

 

You guys really think he could have been doing that all season? You don't think he learned over the course of the season to be better? 


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#5 spaceshoes Posted 06 April 2018 - 09:07 PM

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You guys really think he could have been doing that all season? You don't think he learned over the course of the season to be better?


I don't think he'd be doing this all along. However, I do think that it would have benefited him, as well as the team, if he had gotten some burn throughout the season. Who knows when this type of production would have happened? Could have happened sooner. But back to coaching. What about Fizz?
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#6 Adam42R Posted 06 April 2018 - 09:41 PM

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Swarm and Sting, the guys that reported Nic was done for the year in October?
Here comes McRoberts, the throw to Walker, it's in the aaaaaiiiiirrrr, YESSSSS! Bobcats win it! My my my, Kemba Walker. Steve Martin - Toronto 12/18/2013
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#7 cltblkhscoach Posted 06 April 2018 - 10:00 PM

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Someone go find Allan Bristow and see if he wants to come back. Lol

 

Seriously, we need a faster pace system and ball movement offense. Brooklyn is about the offensive pace I would like to see. Defensively I want someone who is creative with modern tenets of defense, meaning we don't give up open threes like they are still considered low percentage shots. 

 

Who that is? Hell, Silas Jr I still think is a good choice, you just develop your organizational philosophy with him. He's been a hot commodity other places, why not? Stackhouse seems to be getting some run, but I think he needs some more seasoning before making that jump. 

 

As far as veteran coaches go, Ettorre Messina in San Antonio, Mike Woodson in LA Clippers, and Larry Drew in Cleveland if you want to go that route. Nate McMillan in Indiana proved you can still learn and progress being a veteran coach, they have really surprised. 

 

Up and comer I like is Sam Cassell with the Clippers too.  


Allan Bristow Is The GOAT

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#8 Hornets686 Posted 06 April 2018 - 10:01 PM

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Stay if Howard is still here, and if we find a legit back up PG like Shabazz!... And start: Howard, Frank, Batum, Lamb and Kemba


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#9 GeraldWallaceMVP Posted 06 April 2018 - 10:20 PM

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I want him gone, clearly he isn’t delivering results and hardly any player but a Kemba has developed well under him.
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#10 Hornets686 Posted 06 April 2018 - 10:32 PM

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Hard develop when we don't know how to draft...

I want him gone, clearly he isn’t delivering results and hardly any player but a Kemba has developed well under him.


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#11 Founding Hornet Posted 06 April 2018 - 10:33 PM

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I’ll bet my sig that he is here to start the season
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#12 Adam42R Posted 06 April 2018 - 10:51 PM

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I am of mixed mind but mostly because I don't have a guy to slide into the role.  As I am a fan of Nic, I don't like the idea of Silas Jr. getting the reins.  When I think of his dad's style of play and style of coaching, and think of his short stint, I think if you are going to pull in Jr., go ahead and ship out Nic.  And I think there's more potential with a full health and fully functional implementable team style with Nic than Silas will be able to right the ship out of his own concoction of good stuff.  He's not exactly been the same sought after commodity since the overtures for him a few years ago.  I don't think folks in HOU are pouting they didn't pull the trigger.  

 

So with noone that I can say is a guaranteed upgrade, I am not able to say that jettisoning Clifford is the right move.  But I do think you have to take away the scissors from the kid that keeps cutting the upolstery.  If we deal Dwight and he's got to play a more free flowing game, I don't know I am grip-the-chair screaming worried about next year.  However, you keep Howard on this roster and retain Clifford, I am running for the panic room.

 

I guess if I had to identify candidates, I'd be hard pressed to say no to Jay Wright if there was interest.  I keep hearing about Messina and maybe that's a good fit, I don't know - but in the same way I don't know about Silas, I am not sure that there's some absolute that he's a fit.  Fizdale I thought did a great job in MEM so I am struck by why he was shown out there in Kevin McHaleian fashion.  In reality, you could pick any recent former HC from MEM as they've all seemed good and punched above their weight, and all have been fired.  I like Monty Williams probably more than anyone else in the field if he's in the field but it's for the humanistic reasons that I think he should be a guy players absolutely go to the mat for - record-wise, I am not sure he's been more successful than what we have.  Reading up on other folks, it looks like David Vanterpool and Nick Nurse get a lot of NBA credibility from Front Offices.  I would be interested more in Vanterpool because of the parallels to how I see POR's roster moreso than TOR's.  And I like reading that Stott's (whom I like in the mix for COY) credits him as their D coordinator.  It's interesting that in the same survey that had Nurse and Vanterpool 1 & 2, Silas is 4th as far as FO respect points.  

 

Coach, I watched Drew with an eagle eye Teague's first year in ATL and if you don't like the Larry Brown, Steve Clifford style of not playing rookies, you won't be any happier with Drew.  He's the comparative coach I keep making reference between Teague and Monk.  

 

I also should say that I don't know that a Clifford departure has to be forced. Looking at him and knowing his health concerns, he might find that the Assistant life becons.  And furthermore, I would not want much of my frustrations with the coaching staff the last 3 months to indicate I'd be happy of his departure.  I actually like him tremendously and think he is - in the right scenario - a fantastic coach.  I just don't think he's got the flexibility to adapt in real time like we need him to and some of his earlier risk taking has faded to a more strident reliance on what doesn't necessarily work but should work ideally if all x goes to plan.  I think there might be a lot lost in the departures of Price and Ewing and there might be a dearth of help on his staff (again, pointing the finger at Silas for why I am not sold he's got the answers).


Here comes McRoberts, the throw to Walker, it's in the aaaaaiiiiirrrr, YESSSSS! Bobcats win it! My my my, Kemba Walker. Steve Martin - Toronto 12/18/2013
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#13 Swedd523 Posted 07 April 2018 - 06:47 AM

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Cliff has to go. He may be a good, well respected coach, but the results have spoken for themselves. He has consistently underperformed despite the lofty salaries and veteran laden rosters he’s had a hand in shaping.

He’s had his chance. Time to move on.

Who replaces him? I have no clue. I’m sure Roy Williams or some other UNC connection can complete the Friends of Mike Cabal
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#14 kiery101 Posted 07 April 2018 - 07:01 AM

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I'd be willing to part ways with Cliff although I have absolutely no idea who should replace him.
Our defense looks bad this season and I blame our coach for it. If our cast of players can't run his system effectively he needs to adjust his game plan accordingly. We never did that and couldn't find a good balance in between protecting the paint and defending the perimeter.
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#15 Wease2 Posted 07 April 2018 - 06:59 PM

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Cliff needs to go for sure.  I pointed out over the last 3 years that :

 

1.  BIZ didn't get enough burn once he started to improve and we let our defensive intimidator go which killed us in the playoffs the following year.  When BIZ got 20 min per game we normally won during his last couple years but Cliff rarely let this happen

2. Jeremy Lamb should of played during the Heat playoff series and during the season leading up to that series.  We were starving for outside threat and an athlete to score pts nd help rebound since BIZ was gone but Cliff left him on bench entire season when he was clearly ready to contribute.  I told everyone he would be a stud this year if given 20 plus minutes per game and he did not diappoint.  In fact, he should be a starter by his quality of play all year long but Cliff will never let that happen either, He likes the old veterns year after year over the young potential stars he's wasted.  You have to find a happy medium and get the young athletes some consistent run.

 

3. Monk should of gotten more PT for sure but he was clearly lost early in the season.  I think next year he needs to play backup PG and take some minutes from Batum since he sucked most of the year. 

 

I've had enough of his Marvin Williams, Nic Batum love fest.  They are bench players at this stage of their careers!  Play the athletes please and they will improve quicker than you think with enough minuters per game!!!


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#16 pellom Posted 07 April 2018 - 07:52 PM

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I would like to move on as well. I don’t think they’ll do it.
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#17 cltblkhscoach Posted 08 April 2018 - 07:17 PM

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Clifford is very honest. When I asked him about the team's defensive woes in general, he included this sentence in his answer: “Frankly, we do play a number of guys who are just not good defenders.”

http://www.charlotte...e207455094.html

Allan Bristow Is The GOAT

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#18 cltblkhscoach Posted 08 April 2018 - 07:21 PM

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I think he trying to get fired and get a paid year off now. Lol

Allan Bristow Is The GOAT

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#19 Keetch Posted 08 April 2018 - 07:25 PM

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Then he should stop putting them in position to fail.

Literally.
Rollin' in Doh
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#20 Adam42R Posted 08 April 2018 - 07:28 PM

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Clifford is very honest. When I asked him about the team's defensive woes in general, he included this sentence in his answer: “Frankly, we do play a number of guys who are just not good defenders.”

http://www.charlotte...e207455094.html


One of them plays center and gets about 32mpg.
Here comes McRoberts, the throw to Walker, it's in the aaaaaiiiiirrrr, YESSSSS! Bobcats win it! My my my, Kemba Walker. Steve Martin - Toronto 12/18/2013
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